OK, I did the math. Jim Webb Wins the Hardball debate!!!

By: relawson
Published On: 6/8/2006 10:34:27 PM

OK, hopefully this is easy to follow.  I rated this like you would a boxing match.  Each issue was worth a point.  Some "rounds" didn't go to anyone and in others there were clear winners.  I wanted to be fair, so their debate style weighed heavily on my picks.  Ultimately, Webb won by a narrow margin.  Miller is still scum, please don't lose sight of that ;-)

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War in Iraq
Winner: Jim Webb
Miller: didn't seem to oppose going to Iraq on the merits that the invasion was wrong.  He thought we made strategic errors, but believed the "plan".
Webb: Opposed the war before it started, published in WAPO before it started.  His record is clear.

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Immigration
Winner: Miller in the debate.  Webb in reality.  Both support tamper proof IDs.
Miller: Employer sanctions needed
Webb: Complex question; punish large corporations.  In my oppinion after Webb explained himself his position is OK.  From strictly a debate standpoint and ability to enunciate arguments, I'll give this one to Miller.  Not that Miller had a great explanation, but that Jim stumbled some.


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Right to work
Winner: Webb; Miller was weak on this issue
Miller: "Union Checkoff" - opposed to closed shops.
Webb: Reinvigorate the union movement - opposed to closed shops also.
**note to both - unions not pleased with closed shop position.

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Gay Marriage Amendment
Winner: Tied
Webb: Against the amendment, supports civil unions
Miller: Opposed to amendment, supports civil unions

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Gays in Military
Winner: Tied.  I agree with Miller, but both didn't make convincing arguments either way.
Webb: Supports don't ask don't tell.
Miller: "Modify" don't ask don't tell.  Openly gay OK.

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Webb to Miller: As a lobbyist, how would he fix the problems in DC regarding lobbyists?
Miller: Get rid of pork, prohibit any gifts to Congress, Public funding for candidates on TV.

My analysis: BS alarm going off.  Miller actually donated money to people he wouldn't personally support in an election because "the board of directors told him to do it".  Miller will lose the election on this issue should he win the primaries.

Miller to Webb: What is fatiquing about Clinton and prosperity in 2000?
Webb: Things are different now "sea of change".  Defining liberal and conservative differently, and even party alliances.  Many "Reagan Democrats" like Webb went Republican on foreign policy issues.  Never comfortable with Republicans on issues of economic justice and social fairness.  Sees more "Reagan Democrats" coming back into the Democratic party.

Winner: Webb.  Jim threw Webb an easy question - one he has answered a million times.  Miller basicly asked Webb why he was a Republican, but phrased it as a "when did you start beating your wife" type of question.  Despite the poorly phrased and low-blow of a question, Webb handled it well.  So I give him a point for that.

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Should Hillary run for President?
Webb: too early to endorse.  If she wants to run, she should.
Miller: Warner for President in 2008.  If she wants to run she should.
Winner: tied

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Fire Don Rumsfeld?
Miller: Yes
Webb: Won't miss Rummy.  Problem not single person, but the administration.
Winner: Webb is right, but I'll call this one a tie because there really wasn't debate on it.

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President to remove resonsibilities of VP?
Webb: Stuck with him
Miller: not given chance to respond
Winner: none

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Is George Allen qualified?
Webb: Not qualified to be Senator.  Thought we would get leader, but didn't.
Miller: Fought to keep Allen from becoming Senator in first place.  Bad governor, and attacked Allen in variety of issues.
Winner: Miller made a better argument against Allen.  Begrudgingly I give him another point.

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Hillary or Warner for Prez?
Webb: Undecided
Miller: Warner
Winner: none.  Simple oppinion stated, no debate.

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Final Score:
Webb: 3
Miller: 2

Jim Webb Wins!!!

Comments



Interesting analysis. (Lowell - 6/8/2006 10:43:24 PM)
Thanks.


Nice breakdown! (Eric - 6/8/2006 10:50:20 PM)
Thanks for putting it together.

For the participant questions your analysis is good, but unless someone is following the race the BS alarm wouldn't have gone off.  Miller's answer, in and of itself, sounded good.  For those who know, it should be scored for Webb, but the general audience might not see it that way.

George Allen qualified to be Prez?  I was still marvelling over Jim's answer (he's not qualified to be Senator) that I hardly caught Millers.  That was a good zinger on Webb's part so I'm not sure Miller gets the W for this one.