For reasons other than the financial crisis.

As far as Pelosi goes, I think she's done as well as can be expected given the terrible set of circumstances that she's inherited.  The Dems had the opportunity when this crisis first started getting steam last Friday to say "look we're here because the GOP has mismanaged the economy for the past 8 years."  They could have made this an issue on the floor of the Congress.  They didn't.

Instead we had politicians trying to forge some kind of agreement.  The Dems got to work with the Secretary of the Treasury and they held public hearings on the issue where everyone was allowed to speak his or her peace.

Last Thursday when a deal was first to be announced some members of the far-right House coalition dumped a half baked proposal on the table.  (e.g. cuts in corporate capital gains for companies that won't have any capital gains -- how the hell does that unfreeze credit markets?).

Even the Treasury Secretary acknowledged that members of his own party were negotiating in bad faith.

The reality is that a lot of politicians aren't voting for this bill period because it's risky politically and unpopular and there's an election a few weeks away.  Pelosi is a non issue.  It's their own constituents that they're afraid of.  

I think a much smaller number are holding out based on principle -- for better or for worse.

Hurt feelings though aren't a sufficient reason for voting no on a bill -- especially not one that is designed to prevent an economic meltdown.  

I'm fairly confident that Jim Webb won't vote against a measure because someone has hurt his feelings.  He'll put that aside and do the people's business.  That's one reason that its good to have him in the Senate.

On the other side, I'm left scratching my head about someone like Eric Cantor.  What the hell has he actually brought to the table in this whole discussion?  

that in the Senate at the federal level the GOP have launched a record number of filibusters in just one year.  They shattered the previous records.

Why are we seeing gridlock?  Because it serves political purposes of those in the minority.  

If they can't play a constructive role, at least they can obstruct good legislation.

The same is true here in Virginia.  The lesson that the state GOP's far right took from the Mark Warner years is that there are political risks in brokering deals.  With Kaine we've seen the far-right head in the opposite direction.  We've also seen moderate Republicans abandoning the party and endorsing Warner in this year's Senate election, because they appreciate the difficulty of forging deals with partners who continually act in bad faith.

and crocodile tears about how Big Bad Nancy Pelosi made him and his fellow Republicans cry.  The fact is, the Republicans couldn't get their act together, couldn't round up the votes from their own caucus, and now they're flailing around trying to make excuses.  I mean, wow, Nancy Pelosi made the same speech that Democrats have made only like a GAZILLION times now, excoriating the Bush administration for its budget deficits and overall failed economic policies.  Yeah, the Republicans SHOULD be upset, but at themselves for ruining our economy, NOT at Nancy Pelosi who's doing a fine job!

The democrats had almost as many no votes as the Republicans.. WHY?

The Far Left and the Far Right voted the same way..

As much as I dislike Cantor and want him gone, he voted for the bill.. Bobby Scott did NOT..

The far right thought it had too much government involvement and teh far left felt it didnt have enough.. So at least that proved it was a fairly Bi-Partisan approach. Mind you, I am not too fond of it either. Although its a lot better than what was out on thursday of last week.

In any case, I am not blaming her for the loss on the bill. I think she just showed unbelievably bad judgement in her speech.. It was not the time to say what she said right before the vote. Save it for after the vote.. The Democratic leadership should show some restraint and good judgement.. Pelosi hasnt shown me that since she became speaker.

Charles

It's just a convenient scape-goat for Republicans who would be ranting about something else if she'd said nothing at that time.

Cantor and Moran and Davis and Wolf have all been stampeded into a bill that is ...  how to put this politely...  ill-advised and ill-considered.  Frankly I am hoping the new compromise is a little more sensible, and more thoroughly thought through.

Address the fundamental problems, not the symptoms.  The bill we saw shot down yesterday would not really stop foreclosures from happening.  The next attempt (or at least one we see soon) has to address that fundamental problem, for as long as people are choosing to foreclose or are being forced to: no one will be winning.

I listened to the whole speech last night on CSPAN radio since it was so at issue.  I heard nothing divisive and thought she did well for as tired as she must have been.

Now when I hear Cantor speak, I chuckle, what a jerk.  He's really been elevated through this.  

It wasnt as much what she siad, it was how she said it and the timing in which she did. Again, I am not blaming her for the problems the republicans had getting the votes.

To me it just was another nail in the coffin proving she is not a good leader and needs to be replaced. Her judgement and poor leadership just are shining during this moment in time.

That all said, I am not sure the attention for Cantor is all 100% bad. Because I have heard them mention Anita Hartke a number of times since this started. Maybe some sort of "equal time" issue. In any case, she is at least getting some free media time due to it.

Cause right now she needs it.. Shes a great nominee and needs all the help she can get.

Charles

Its not that she "Hurt thier feelings".. To me it was the matter in which she did it and the timing. After a week of bi-partisan work, it was her job to thank all those that helped and worked on the bi-partisan comprimise. It wasn't time to grandstand. Didn't we have enough from McCain on that..

Mind you I am not putting the failure to get the vote on her shoulders completely, or her comments for that matter. My point is was showed why thier is so much gridlock. She is a terrible speaker, and has been a terrible speaker. She is to partisan, to liberal, and to devisive. It comes down to Judgement.. she showed a complete lack of it and its not the first time.. or second or third.. or....

It's time for moderate democrats to take control. The ONLY way an Obama presidency will get anything done is with a bi-partisan group of moderate democrats and republicans moving the issues of energy policy, healthcare, etc.. to a middle ground that everyone can live with.

If we have the left and right constantly fighting with each other, and the same "leadership" in congress. The moderates will get drowned out. It will in turn hamstring the Obama presidency. We saw it in Clintons first term. It wasn't until there was a change and moderate Republicans and Moderate Democrats worked together that he got anything done. Sadly, that took Republican control of congress to accomplish. Which is what will happen in 2010 if the Democrats are not real productive, really fast inbetween 2008 and 2010. Which means we HAVE to have new leadership.

So why not while the Democrats have control of the house, senate and white house shouldn't the moderates take control and prove we can get things acomplished.

Obama is right we need a change.. but it needs to be 100% change. Fresh blood in leadership of the house and senate along with the white house.

Because to behonest I am friggin tired of the far left rethoric as much as I am tired of the old worn out rethoric of the far right. If its not the far right screwing up things its the far left. Because both are completely disconnected from what is good for the average American, and what the average American wants.

It maybe hard to believe.. but NIETHER complete government control and regulation NOR deregulation and free market stratagies will work to solves this countries problems. it has to be something in the middle. The only way I feel to get to that point is start by getting rid of Pelosi and Reid.

Charles

that NEITHER (and it's "NEITHER" not "NIETHER", by the way) "complete government control and regulation NOR deregulation and free market stratagies will work to solves this countries problems." Also, I don't think you'll find too many "far left" or "far right" people on this blog. But keep throwing around ideological buzz words if you enjoy that sort of thing.

Yea.. I didnt like it either.. I was having a brain fart. When I typed it.. I type a bit fast and sometimes get a few words backward. I normally rewrite these things 4-5 times. I was typing off the hip and not reading through everything as well. So my apologizes.

Thats why I like this website.. over the years I have found it to be more moderate.. but thats pretty much the nature of Virginia Democrats. Its also why I feel comfortable posting here.

As for "buzz words".. sorry to use them. Just short cut more than anything else. My use of the term "FAR" means they are so far to one side that they are stuck in not only thier ideology but they are also unwilling to compromise. So they tend to be so set in thier ways that even moderate solutions are off handedly ignored or rejected without actually looking at the solution.

Thats more of what I meant.. I will try to hold back on the "Buzz Words" in the future.  

Couldn't help notice those swinging dangling earrings she wore yesterday. Sexist remark ? Not at all. If Steny had worn some sort of distracting tie..would make similar observation.

They all looked tired- but better times are ahead. Back to work.

I don't see the problem.  I like the speech.  A bill has to be passed.  It should have been done so they don't have to come back after the Jewish holiday.
I think 90 some Republican votes was enough so I'm irritated the Dems didn't come up with the numbers.

However, let us not forget that the problem is in the White House.  Pelosi and Reid are not the problem.  They reflect the will of their colleagues.  So, they aren't TV stars.  We got our TV star.  I am quite satisfied with him.

I have to add this:  The first woman Speaker does not get offed unless she does something awful.  We cannot afford that.  I like Pelosi despite the fact that I opposed her when she first ran for Congress.  I lived in her district and supported her opponent in the primary.

Anyway, lets not turn to cannibalism when we are so close to victory.

Not to sound like "I voted for it before I voted against it"

But it wasnt simply the President at fault..

We have a majority in the house and senate.. and with common sense MODERATE solutions to the problems with this country any good leader can help form a good bill to pass the house. Be it immigration, etc..

We can't have common sense MODERATE solutions, with those that are not liked, and are not willing to work with the other side with a sense of true bi-partisanship.

We will NEVER move Reid off being anti-Nuclear.. He is from NEVADA.. where they have read FAR too many Green Peace propaganda pieces about Nuclear energy.

I can tell you Virginia has some of the lowest electric costs. WHY? Nuclear and Hydro Electric Power. I feel safe next to North and South Anna.. The only thing I am concerned about is the waste stored there.. There should be a solution.. I dont know.. like a Granite mountain in the middle of no where.. OH WAIT we have that.. It's called YUCCA MOUNTAIN.. IN REIDS' State..

Before you give the water table issue or anything.. PLEASE PLEASE first off look at the Geological record in the area and then DRIVE THROUGH THE AREA.. There is No where in the planet safer to put the waste OR reprocess it.. Its is a perfect solution.. NO. But compare the energy we can create vs the other solutions. It's the cleanest energy we have. Look where technology has come in the last 40 years... in 40 years from now we could pull the waste out of Yucca and use it in other ways. If not its BURIED IN A MOUNTAIN IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE !! Much better than sitting in a pool outside of 100 different cities risking terrorist attacks or enviromental disaster.

But I digress.. As Reid is against nuclear energy, amongst other thing he will not move on..  Pelosi is against not being arrogant and condesending... Its hard to get a group to work with you when you are so far removed from the group in you opinons and well simply the other side doesn't like you..

Anyway, its late and I know I rambled.. but what it comes down to is our leadership in congress is so entrenched old politics its time we start fresh and that includes not only Obama, but also includes New leadership in congress.

Charles