Sounds stronger, looks more coherent.  Talking in simplier language.  Also the Ted Kennedy thing shows some class.  Come on Obama; find your voice.

You must be watching a different channel. :)

He brought up the bears, come on Obama show me the seals.

:)

McCain is using his stump speech.  And, rather shakey too.

Question we need to ask ourselves, how did we get into this situation in the first place?  Warned several years about this.  Yes, we've got to solve this problem short term, but also have to look at how we shredded so many regulations, didn't set up 21st century regulatory framework, that's part of a philosophy that regulation is always bad.

Come on candidates this is a debate. Mix it up.

A lot of this saw this coming. Eisenhower on night before D-Day wrote two letters, one for victory and one of resignation.  Somehow we've lost that...we've got to hold people accountable and reward people who succeed.  Today, greed and excess is rewarded.  People will be held accountable in my administration.

Obama - Yes, we need more responsibility, but not just during a crisis.  We've had years of "what's good for Wall Street not for Main Street."  McCain said fundamentals of economy are strong.  I just fundamentally disagree.  We have to hold ourselves accountable day in/day out.  People have financial crisis going on every month.

McCain: We've got to fix this system.  Fundamental problems in the system.  Main Street paying for the greed of Wall Street.  There's no doubt we have a long way to go.  Regulatory agencies need to do their job.  Fundamental belief in the strength, productivity of American worker, the United States of America.  Our best days are ahead of us.

A lot of this saw this coming. Eisenhower on night before D-Day wrote two letters, one for victory and one of resignation.  Somehow we've lost that...we've got to hold people accountable and reward people who succeed.  Today, greed and excess is rewarded.  People will be held accountable in my administration.

Obama - Yes, we need more responsibility, but not just during a crisis.  We've had years of "what's good for Wall Street not for Main Street."  McCain said fundamentals of economy are strong.  I just fundamentally disagree.  We have to hold ourselves accountable day in/day out.  People have financial crisis going on every month.

McCain: We've got to fix this system.  Fundamental problems in the system.  Main Street paying for the greed of Wall Street.  There's no doubt we have a long way to go.  Regulatory agencies need to do their job.  Fundamental belief in the strength, productivity of American worker, the United States of America.  Our best days are ahead of us.

We have to get spending under control.  Republicans came to power to change government and government changed us. Tom Coburn calls earmarking a "gateway drug."  Evils of earmarking and pork barrel spending.  As president, I've got a pen and I'm going to veto every single spending bill that comes across my desk.  Obama has asked for $932 million in pork barrel spending, nearly $1 million a day he's been in Congress.

Obama:  Sen. McCain is right that earmark process has been abused.  I suspended requests for my home state until system was cleaned up. Let's be clear, earmarks account for $18 billion in last year's budget. McCain is proposing $300 billion in tax cuts to wealthiest corporations.  In his tax plan, CEO's of Fortune 500 companies would get huge tax breaks, leave 100 million Americans out. We need to grow economy from bottom up. Tax cut for 95% of Americans.  Over time, that will be a better recipe for economic group than policies of President Bush that John McCain wants to follow.

McCain: Obama suspended those projects after he started running for president. I hear this all the time, "it's only $18 billion." It corrupts people.  It's a system that has to be cleaned up.  I was called "the sheriff."  I didn't win Miss Congeniality in Senate.  Obama's proposing hundreds of billions in new spending.  The worst thing we can do is raise people's taxes.

Obama:  I don't know where John's getting his figures.  I close corporate loopholes.  Health care system where everyone has coverage.  nobody's denying that $18 billion is important.  We need earmark reform, but eliminating them alone is NOT a recipe for how we get middle class back on track.  We can't afford another 4 years of Bush policies.

McCain: Business taxes are too high in America compared to somewhere like Ireland.  I want to cut business tax so that businesses will remain in US and create job.  It's not just $18 billion.  2,000 earmarks.  Obama is a recent convert.  I want people to have tax cuts. Every family $5,000 refundable tax credit for health care.  Worst thing we can do is raise taxes on anybody.

Obama: My definition...95% of you will get a tax cut. If you make less than a quarter million per year, you won't see one dime worth of tax increases.  Problem is that there are so many loopholes, our businesses effectively pay one of the lowest rates in the world. It's not like you want to close the loopholes.  He intends to tax health benefits. It is not a good deal for the American people. It's an example of market solving everything...

McCain: Classic example of walking the walk not talking the talk.  Who fought against wasteful and earmark spending? Who believes in a tax system that is fundamentally fair?  Let's give Americans a choice, existing tax code or new tax code.  Look at the record, particularly energy bill.  Obama has shifted on numerous occasions.

Obama:  It's just not true. Under your tax plan, oil companies would get another $4 billion in tax breaks.  We'd all love to lower taxes on everybody. If oil companies get them, that means others are not.  I was opposed to those tax breaks, tried to strip them out. We've got an energy bill right now, you're opposed to it because it would strip away tax breaks to oil companies.

Courtroom stenographer.

Dood, you are a machine. Well done, as always.  

I'm hoping that McCain will start to fail as the minutes drag on.  He just slurred and stumbled a bit.

is starting to droop.

Obama looks sharp so far, and Presidential.  Impressive...so far

Obama: There are a range of things that will probably have to be delayed. Some things have to be done - energy independence.  Invest in alternative energy, increase production at home.  We have to fix our health care system.  Families getting crushed. Will make our businesses and families better off.  We have to invest in science and technology, make sure our children are keeping pace. Rebuild our infrastructure, roads and bridges, broadband, electricity grid.  Things we have to do structurally, we can't shortchange those things. Eliminate programs that don't work.

McCain: We've got to cut spending.  We've let government get out of control. Obama has most liberal voting record in Congress.  Eliminate ethanol subsidies. Do away with cost-plus contracts in defense.  We need to get cost overruns under control.  I saved $6.8 billion on contract between Boeing and DOD.  I know how to do this.  We have to examine every agency of government.
I
Obama: There are going to be things that will have to be deferred and delayed.  I'm not willing to give up need to become energy independent, but there may be parts we have to give up.  We need to change the culture. "Liberal" means I've opposed George W. Bush.  On the other hand, I worked with Tom Coburn to set up Google for Government.

McCain: Spending freeze on everything but defense, veterans, and several other vital issues.

Obama: That's using a hatchet when you need a scalpel.  I want to increase early childhood education.  Savings on Iraq, we're spending $10 billion a month when they have a surplus.

McCain: We're sending $700 billion a year overseas to countries that don't like us. We need renewables, also nuclear power and offshore drilling. Obama opposes storage of spent nuclear fuel. 45 new nuclear plants by 2030. Nuclear will help reduce dependence on foreign oil and deal with climate change.

Obama: There is no doubt that this will affect our budgets, even if we get $700 billion back. We may not see that money for a while.  Less tax revenue because economy's slowingdown. As president, i'll have to make tough decisions. We have to know what our values are.  Tax cuts for people who don't need them and are not even asking them?

McCain: I don't want to hand health care system over to federal government.  I want families to make decisions with their doctors, not the federal government. Obama has $800 billion in new spending programs. A healthy economy with low taxes is probably the best recipe for having our economy recover.  Spending restraint has got to be a vital part of that. We owe China $500 billion. I have fought against excessive spending my entire career.

Obama:  John, it's been your president who you said you agreeed with 90% of the time who presided over this enormous increase in spending. You voted for his budgets.

McCain: I have opposed the president on climate change, spending, torture of prisoners, Guantanamo Bay. The American people know me very well. I'm a maverick, have a partner who's a maverick.

BO: You've voted for most of these budgets . . . it is hard to swallow.  Great hit...total body blow.

I think the Miss Congeniality line is a setup for some kind of trap for Obama.

Oh, crap, he just indirectly mentioned Palin.  Minus 1000 points for McCain.

Obama proud of his VP pick.  Can you say the same thing, McCain?  Gohead, say it.

May I present you with your ass?

McCain just said the most shocking thing I think I've heard in a debate in a long time -- the next President isn't going to have to explain why the last President went into Iraq? What an absolute asshole, please ignore what I've voted for and the results of my votes.  

I cannot believe this man.  John McCain is beyond help.  He has no conscience.  He'd do or say anything.

McCain:  Can't have a failed strategy, war was very badly mishandled.  I said we had to change the strategy.  We came up with a strategy that has succeeded, and we will come home with victory and with honor.  We will see a stable ally in the region and a fledgling Democracy.  Consequences of defeat would have been a wider war, increased Iranian influence. We are winning in Iraq.  

Obama:  This is an area where we have a fundamental difference.  I stood up 6 years ago and opposed this war when it was politically risky to do so.  We hadn't finished the job in Afghanistan, we hadn't caught Bin Laden.  I thought Iraq would be a distraction. Bush and McCain had a different judgment. We've spendt $600 billion, lost over 4,000 lives, Al Qaeda is resurgent, we took our eye off the ball. We are still spending $10 billion a month at a time when we are in great distress here at home.  The lesson to be drawn is that we have to use military wisely and we did not do that in Iraq.

McCain: The next president will have to decide how we leave, when we leave.  Obama said surge would not work.  Yet, he still says he would oppose the surge even though it's worked.  Obama didn't go to Iraq for 900 days and didn't ask for meeting with Gen. Petraeus. It's remarkable.

Obama: I'm proud of my VP selection, chair of foreign relations committee.  Sen. Mccain is right that the violence has been reduced as a result of sacrifice of our military.  Gen. Petraeus has done a magnificent job. That was a tactic to deal with the failure of war from 2003. You said war would be quick and easy. You were wrong. You said you know where the WMD were, you were wrong.  Etc.  If the question is who is best equipped to use the military, you can lookat our judgment.

McCain: Obama doesn't know difference between tactics and strategy.  "Let us win."  They are winning.  Sen. Obama refuses to acknowledge we are winning in Iraq.  Peace comes to the country and prosperity, and it wasn't a tactic it was a strategy.  Sen. Obama voted to cut off funds for troops.

Obama: Sen. McCain opposed funding for troops in legislation that had a timetable because he opposed a timetable. I opposed blank check to Bush.  We had no difference on funding troops.  I absolutely understand difference between tactics and strategy.  The question is, was this wise?  We need more resources in Afghanistan.  McCain said we were successful in Afghanistan, even though Bin Laden was still out there. We need to give Iraq back its country.  End the war responsibly, in phases, reduce our combat troops, bolster efforts in afghanistan, capture or kill Bin Laden.

McCain: Admiral Mullen said Obama's approach would be dangerous. Iraq is central battleground.  Successes are fragile.  Dangerous to set specific date for withdrawal.  Surge didn't succeed beyond my wildest expectations.

It is getting old (older than McCain).

My plan would have stabilized the situation in Iraq months ago and we'd have defeated the Taliban if you'd listened to me.

Tally me banana!  =)

Hey-oh...

Obama as a warmonger and Mc-Bomb-Iran a peacemaker.  Holy crap.  The revisionism never stops.  Day is night night is day. Too many complete lies here that there isn't time to refute.  This is what they do.  

Nice O.  McCain is looking agitated.

McCain is so XXXXXX condescending.  

What does that mean? "You don't say that outloud"????

Wow!  He's channeling Nixon.  Bomb now. Explain later.  Or not.  

Obama: Yes. Situation getting worse not better. Highest fatalities since 2002. Al Qaeda and Taliban crossing the border, feeling emboldened.  We cannot separate Afghanistan from Iraq. I'd send 2-3 additinoal brigades to Afghan.  In Iraq, no connection to 9/11, no Al Qaeda before we went in. Strategic mistake. Al Qaeda is the greatest threat.  Central front is in Afghanistan and Pakistan. It's not just more troops. Afghan government has to work for its people. Deal with growing poppy trade.  We've got to deal with Pakistan, safe havens for Taliban and Al Qaeda.  Bush and McCain have given Pakistan billions of dollars, but they haven't gotten rid of safe havens.

McCain:  I won't repeat mistake of washing hands of the region. We can't ignore lessons of history. If you're gonna aim a gun at someone, you'd better be prepared to pull the trigger. I'm not prepared to cut off relations with Pakistan. We need support of Pakistani people.  You don't say out loud that we'll launch strikes into Pakistan. I've been to Waziristan, I can see how tough the terrain is. Obama doesn't understand that we need new strategy, not just more troops. We have to get cooperation of people in those areas.  We've got a lot of work to do in Afghanistan.

Obama: I didn't talk about attacking Pakistan.  I said if we have bin laden in our sites and Pakistan is unwilling to act, we should take him out.  You've threatened extinction of Korea, sung "bomb bomb bomb Iran."  This is not an easy situation. Cross border attacks against US troops.  Our troops can just be on the defensive and absorb blows again and again or we can change strategy.  We coddled Musharaff, alienated Pakistani population, had attitude of "he may be a  dictator but he's our dictator."

McCain: I don't think Obama understands that there was a failed state in pakistan when Musharaff comes to power.  I voted against sending Marines into Lebanon under Reagan.  I supported the first Gulf war.  I supported going into Bosnia. It was the right thing to do.  I supported what we did in Kosovo to stop ethnic cleansing and genocide.  Opposed turning force in Somalia from peace keeping to peace making.  Wearing bracelet with woman's son's name on it, do everything in your power to make sure my son's death was not  in vain.  We don't want defeat.  I know what it's like when an army is defeated.  I know how hard it is. We will win this one.

Obama: I've got a bracelet too, given to me in Green Bay. Can you please make sure that no mother goes through what i'm going through. We honor all the service that our troops provide, they've performed brilliantly. The question is, are we making good judgments?  we took our eye off Afghanistan. Nobody's talking about defeat in Iraq.  It's not true that you've been consistently concerned with afghanistan. You don't muddle through central front on terrorism.

McCain: You might think Obama would have gone to Afghanistan.  I've visited Afghanistan and i know what our security requirements are.  If we suffer defeat in Iraq by set date for withdrawal, that will have a calamitous effect on afghanistan.

Ahmadinejad, Ahmadinejad.

That is the soundbite of the night.

he would make the North Koreans taller!

mcCain: Nuclear weapons would be existential threat to Israel and threat to rest of region - arms race. We cannot allow a second holocaust. Form a league of Democracies.  The Russians are preventing significant action in UN Security Council. We could impose significant, meaningful,painful sanctions on Iran.  Lousy government in Iran.  Work with french, British,Germans. Iranians are continuing on path to nuclear weapons. Putting lethal IED's into Iraq and killing young Americans.  Republican Guard in Iran.  Serious threat to security in the world.

Obama:  I believe the republican guard of Iran is a terrorist organization.  The single thing that has strengthened Iran is the war in Iraq. That was Iran's mortal enemy, they were cleared away. They've gone from zero centrifuges to 4,000 centrifuges. We cannot tolerate nuclear Iran, it would be a game changer.  Arms race in Middle East possible.  We need tougher sanctions.  We will need cooperation from Russia and China. Tough, direct diplomacy with Iran. Not talking to people has not worked.

McCain: Obama said he'd sit down with Ahmedinejad,Castro, and Chavez without preconditions.  Ahmedinejad is espousing extinction of Israel, Obama's talking about sitting down with him and legitimize his behavior.  Reagan met with Gorbachev. Nixon to china.  Have to be preconditions.

Obama:  Ahmedinejad is not the most powerful person in Iran.  I reserve the right to meet with anyone at a time and place of my choosing to keep American safe.  Henry Kissinger is one of his advisors,just said we should meet with iran without preconditions.  It doesn't mean you invite them over for tea.  It means we don't do what we've been doing.  Difference between preconditions and preparations. It may not work, because Iran is a rogue regime. President Bush recently sent senior ambassador to talk to Iran. It may not work, but we strengthen our alliances. North Korea - they were a member of the Axis of evil, they tested a nuke, they sent nuclear secrets to countries like Syria, Bush Admin. reversed course on this and we made some progress.  The Bush admin., Sen. Mccain's own advisors all think this is important. McCain wouldn't even meet with the prime minister of Spain, a NATO ally.

McCain: I'm not going to set visitor's schedule before I'm president. What Sen. Obama doesn't seem to understand that if you sit down with someone like Ahmedinejad, you legitimize his outrageous comments (e.g., Israel is a "stinking corpse"). North Korea is a terrible regime, huge gulag.  North Koreans have broken every agreement they've entered into. Trust but verify - Ronald reagan.

Obama;  Sen. Mccain keeps on using this example. Nobody has been talking about sitting down without preparations. Kissinger DID say we should meet without preconditions. You can't solve every problem before you talk.  The notion that we would sit with Ahmedinejad and let him spew his nonsense...

McCain: What, you'd say "no you won't wipe out Israel..."

Obama:  Putin says he can see Sarah Palins house from Russia!

Just kidding, of course.

But, what else is new.

Ohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease ...

 will he say "He doesn't understand"?  

I'd say, at least 10 more times.

Obama: You can't be a 21st century power and act like 20th century dictator.  Action in Georgia unacceptable. Countries free to join NATO if they meet conditions. Can't return to Cold war posture with russia.  Loose nukes is an area I've led on, working with Dick Lugar,that's an area we have to work with Russia. You don't deal with Russia by looking into his eyes and seeing his soul, you have to act according to national interest.

McCain: Obama's first statement was that both sides should show restraint. Russia committed serious aggression against Georgia.  Naivete on Obama's part. I looked into putin's eyes and saw three letters - KGB.  We need to bolster our friends and allies.  They are fueled by petrodollars. Georgia war was about energy, pipeline.  Other countries showed solidarity with Georgia.  We will support inclusion of Georgia and Ukraine into NATO. Russians are in violation of ceasefire agreement.  Russian intentions to Georgia have been very clear.  We want to work with Russians, but they need to behave like a country that respects international boundaries. This has a lot to do with ukraine, Crimea...Russian fleet.

Obama: I think Sen Mccain and I agree for the most part on these issues.  We forcefully objected to Russian invasion of Georgia. I was the first to say we need to rebuild Georgian economy so that Saakashvili could be replaced.  We have to have foresight and anticipate some of these problems. I warned about this.  Energy - Russia is in part resurgent because of petrodollars.  That means that we, as one of the biggest consumers of oil, have to have an energy strategy, increase domestic production but we only have 3% of world's oil supplies so we can't simply drill our way out of the problem. Need alternative energy, nuclear, "clean coal" technology.  Over 26 years, McCain voted 23 times against alternative energy.  

McCain: Obama is against reprocessing. Offshore drilling is important. I supported Nunn-Lugar back in 1990s.

Obama: I have never said I reject to nuclear waste, i've said we have to store it safely.  

I am highly biased and think that Obama won hands down.

But, with that said, I think it is a draw.  McCain is a scrapy guy and his followers will love how he is such a prick, to put it bluntly.  They low that crap.

Obama did no harm.  The polls probably won't move at all, I hope.  I am not depressed over this debate and expect we'll see a slight momemtum blip in the polls and then it will start moving again more towards Obama.  Thats my gut feeling.

McCain has the balls to say he loves and will work for veterans?  But didn't support Webbs GI bill?

Obama didn't hit him for that.

I was still stationed in Baghdad when Jim Webb was fighting tooth and nail for veterans and McCain was ruminating about how people will leave the service if their educational bennies are too good.  

Right wing talking points:
-Obama failed to deliver a knock out
-Obama backed down and didn't look presidential.
-McCain suprisingly coherent.  

McCain:  We're safer but a long way from safe. Sen. Lieberman and I after 9/11 wanted a commission. Families of 9/11 descended on Washington and we passed that legislation.  Bipartisan, reaching across the aisle. We have a long way to go in human intelligence. Never torture a prisoner ever again. Work more closely with our allies. America is safer but we have a long way to go.  We need to do a better job along our borders as well.

Obama:  We're safer in some ways, but we still have a long way to go. Need to harden our chemical sites, ports.  Biggest threat is not a nuclear missile, it's a nuclear weapon in a suitcase, terrorist getting a nuke.  We need missile defense, but we also need to spend more on nuclear proliferation. Al Qaeda now operating in 60 countries. Need more cooperation with allies.  Must understand that the way we are perceived in the world will affect how much cooperation we will get. This is the greatest country on earth, but because of mistakes, we are less respected today and need to restore the sense that America is a shining beacon on a hill.

McCain: I agree.  Missile defense was a major factor in ending Cold War. Sen. Obama still doesn't get it.  Leaving Iraq will embolden Al Qaeda, possible defeat, loss of the sacrifice we made.  We can't do what Sen. Obama wants to do. Central issue of our time.

Obama: Over last 8 years, this administration and Sen. McCain have been solely focused on Iraq.  Bin Laden is still out there, Al Qaeda resurgent. Challenges with China. They are active all over the world.  We have weakened our capacity to project power around the world because we have viewed everything through this single lens, spending $10 billion a month in Iraq.  We're not investing in American infrastructure, this is a national security issue.  We're not talking about losing this war, we're talking about broader strategic vision.

McCain: I've been involved...advantages to knowledge and experience. I don't believe Obama has that knowledge and experience.  We've seen this stubbornness before. Obama fails to acknowledge he was wrong about the surge.  Veterans know I'll take care of them, I love them.  Reform, prosperity, peace. I don't need any on the job training.

Obama: My father came from Kenya. He wanted to go to college in the United States because our values inspired the entire world.  Today, our standing is not the same.  We need to send a message to the world that we are going to invest in education, how ordinary people will live out their dreams.

Mccain: When I came home from prison, I saw our veterans being badly treated and it made me sad. I guarantee you, I know how to heal the wounds of wars, deal with our adversaries and our friends.

a few points.  Barck had the facts on his side.  The question is how many viewers know that.  Barack conceded too many points to McCain.  The moderator and Barack let McCain lie so many times it was ridiculous.  He took credit for so many things he had nothing to do with (and even voted against) that I lost count.

The format sucked.

Everyone on Faux, except for Juan, thinks McCain won.  

They seem to think that both did well. I tend to agree.

By the way, it's the Revolutionary Guard in Iran, NOT the "Republican Guard."  That was Iraq under Saddam.  Both McCain and Obama got that wrong.

The question is, what does that mean? I really am not sure, although given that McCain is behind, he needs to move the needle.

It will be interesting to see what the snap polls show.

He needed to knock it out of the park, but he bunted.  

Foreign policy is supposedly McCain's strong point, and he did not "win".  That's a loss.

Obama really needed to pass the credibility test, a la Reagan in 1980, and he more than did that.

We've been hearing all along from the MSM that Obama lacks foreign policy experience and that this is McCain's area of strength.  The fact that there's even a thought that Obama won this is a huge success for Obama and a bad sign for McCain.  This is the night McCain should have hit it out of the park.  But you're right...he bunted.  Given that the next debate is the VPs, that bunt may turn out to be a suicide squeeze.

It just means that there was no zinger to repeat endlessly on the recap specials. I feel a little disappointed, because there were a lot of places where O could have slammed McCain pretty hard, but he also gave smooth, forceful answers that were more compact and to-the-point than McCain's rambling answers (especially on the Russia exchange). Lacking a zinger to define the debate, and thus (possibly) redefine the race, nothing changes. Obama remains ahead.

See here:

Forty percent of uncommitted voters who watched the debate tonight thought Barack Obama was the winner. Twenty-two percent thought John McCain won. Thirty-eight percent saw it as a draw.

Forty-six percent of uncommitted voters said their opinion of Obama got better tonight.

Sixty-eight percent of uncommitted voters think Obama would make the right decisions about the economy. Forty-one percent think McCain would.

Forty-nine percent of these voters think Obama would make the right decisions about Iraq. Fifty-five percent think McCain would.

Awesome results on McCain's supposed strong suit of foreign policy!

seems to show Obama with a HUGE lead about who won the debate on CNN, MSNBC, and CBS while I didn't see any specific poll on ABC or Fox(?!?!).  Maybe Fox was scared what their own people would say.  Bottom line - I thought it was a draw but huge numbers of late night poll takers thought McCain lost big time.  I can live with that...

Has McCain winning the debate. Respectable news outlet that he is.

...90% of people think Obama won. :)

doG love ya.

Sitting here watching the debate on a big screen in California with a group of active duty officers, most of whom just recently returned from Iraq...

just relaying comments as shouted out...

Obama interrupting McCain -- appears rude, not Presidential.  Obama looking like he's losing his cool.
Interrupting again.

Talking about Iraq....not sure what's going on...several loud shouts at screen at Obama...YOU'RE AN IDIOT!
Pounding of fists on bar.

MORE....You're an idiot!  Shouting.

Obama keeps stating..."Senator McCain, You're absolutely right".....

Obama out of his depth...doesn't have the depth of experience....

McCain...understands leading from the front....Obama has never made fact finding missions to the region...

Sorry, fellows...consensus here is Obama came off looking like a rude lightweight, no understanding of the issues, can't discuss issues going past talking points his handlers have pounded into him...

I am disappointed that Sen Obama couldn't control himself and was very rude, interrupting, etc.  Sen McCain did a good job of staying polite and on-message.

Best line: McCain: "I don't need any on the job training".

Will be interesting to see how the professional commentators review this tommorrow...

Night all....

pffft

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Every time McCain said that Obama just doesn't understand, Barack proceeded to (1) demonstrate that he understands very well, indeed and (2) that he brings a much broader, more thoughtful perspective to the issues than "Bomb, bomb, bomb Iran" McSame. McCain kept saying, "I....I....I....," talking about stuff twenty or thirty years ago, never replying to Obama's pointed remarks about his saying, for example, that we could "muddle through in Afghanistan."  

Says people will feel comfortable with McCain as CiC because no one knows the world as good as him.

I'm comfortable, because McCain has demonstrated throughout this campaign what a level-headed, consistent and predictable person he would be.

on who won the debate.

Obama won big time on economy.

Opinion of Obama: Better 46%, worse 7%

Wow, that's a big win for Obama!

Krauthammer on Faux now.

Says debate was even on points, but asserts that the election is a referendum on Obama, and he certainly passed the test.

Now says McCain hammered Obama in the second half, but he didn't make the case to back it up.

He is suprisingly critical of McCain's perfromance.

"Overall ... I think [Obama] comes out neutral, and thus ahead. ... If you come out essentially a draw on an area that is not your strength," it's a win. Also, because later debates on economy will benefit Obama.

Holy sh*t. Charles Krauthammer has been taken over by aliens!

FWIW I thought both left something on the table - especially Obama.  While he did have some really strong statements, he also didn't come back at McCain as strongly as he could have in many cases.  And he did seem to have a bit of a problem focusing and staying on one subject - a couple of times he'd switch mid sentence to a different topic or point.

McCain really wasn't any better - especially that creepy smile when Obama was talking.  Mostly kept going back to the basic talking points.  Although I think he did come across as smoother right toward the end.  Not necessarily correct, but smoother and Obama almost, but didn't quite, match him there at the end.   Although I do think Obama presented himself better for most of the rest of the debate.

Overall I'd call it a lackluster draw, but due to very high expectations for Obama (and low for McCain) and the smoother finale for McCain, I'd give a very slight nod to McCain.  But for all those undecided people hoping that this debate would make a difference and help them choose, I don't think either candidate made any significant headway (although each probably did make strong impressions on the smaller segment of single issue voters in respective topics).

Watching Biden on CNN taking the hammer to McCain.  Meanwhile we are left asking why isn't Palin a surrogate for McCain on CNN?

Wolf just asked that very question.

Anderson Cooper: "Don't hold your breath."

At what point will the McCain camp realize that continuing to hide Palin only reinforces what is becoming the generally accepted opinion that she's not fit for the office?  I mean when you send out Guilliani as your surrogate when the other side sends their VP...

No matter what he says, he seems to still be fighting the cold war. I just feel like he could do something really rash. He had a wild look in his eyes more than once, almost like he was ready to push the button.

He also lied several times about his support for Veterans. He has consistently voting against fully funding the VA. Too bad he wasn't honest. He could have said he would save money by cutting back on VA funding.

Obama to hit him on the GI Bill. I think I said this already too.

I wasn't satisfied by either candidate's discussion of Afghanistan.  I keep thinking back to what Admiral Mullen recently said:

Last week, Admiral Michael Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told Congress "we're running out of time" in Afghanistan. "I'm not convinced we're winning it in Afghanistan," Adm. Mullen testified.

Perhaps foreshadowing the NIE assessment on Afghanistan, Adm. Mullen told Congress, "absent a broader international and interagency approach to the problems there, it is my professional opinion that no amount of troops in no amount of time can ever achieve all the objectives we seek in Afghanistan."

http://www.abcnews.go.com/Blot...

So what are we going to do there -- throw more combat brigades in?  What's our ultimate goal -- just to kill OBL?  Or are we going to stay there to try to "eradicate" the Taliban?  

Al Queda's original strategy was to strike at the U.S. in order to draw us into a ground war in Afghanistan which would weaken us just as it weakened the USSR.  The U.S. offensive in Afghanistan after 9/11 was widely regarded as brilliant precisely because it avoided that trap.

So why now is it smart to start throwing more and more brigades into Afghanistan?  We are a hell of a lot weaker now, than we were right after 9/11, and I think it would be a mistake to take the bait now, just as it was then.

Admiral Mullen's statement on Afghanistan starts at about 15:30 and he makes his statement that no amount of troops in no amount of time" can achieve our goals in Afghanistan is at 19:50.

http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=...

McCain's suggestion of replicating the surge in Afghanistan isn't going to work, absent elimination of the safe havens across the Pakistani border.

Bottom line is that they are talking about sending 2-3 more brigades to Afghanistan in the next year, and are asking for $20 billion for the Afghanistan operations.

I think we ought to think very hard about escalating in Afghanistan and getting bogged down there for another 10 years.

Eisenhower took responsibilty for the failure in his famous memo but he never said he was resigning.  

http://blogs.abcnews.com/polit...

over at 538 you get this comment:

I'm slightly scared about the way Obama says "Pakistan" and the "Taliban"

Oh, you mean how he said them correctly? Yes, it sounds silly but then it isn't English. McCain couldn't even get Ahmadinejad out correctly. "ock - ma - dean - ij - haad"