AAA: "the fees cannot continue as is."

By: Lowell
Published On: 8/24/2007 8:16:34 AM

Finally -- what took them so long?!? -- AAA has thrown in the towel on the abusive "abuser fees."  According to today's Washington Post, "AAA Mid-Atlantic urged lawmakers to consider a special session this fall to deal with the fees.," adding that "the motorists of Virginia have said they are outraged."  The article adds:

AAA, which has 835,000 members in Virginia, initially supported the fees, a stance it reiterated as recently as last month. But Townsend said AAA now believes "it's clear the fees cannot continue as is."

If a special session is not held, Townsend said, the Republican majority could be threatened in the November election, when all 140 seats of the legislature are on the ballot.

In conclusion, Townsend states the obvious, that "Virginians don't like the law, period."  Well, yeah!

In response, the Republican speaker of the House of Delegates, Bill Howell, has announced he would be scrapping "announced a plan to expand the state's so-called civil remedial fee program to include out-of-state drivers." 

Unfortunately for that idea, one neighboring state has already balked:

Maryland Senate President Thomas V. Mike Miller Jr. (D-Calvert) said he doubts that Maryland would cooperate because Virginia's fees are too steep.

"I can't imagine Marylanders being forced to pay an exorbitant fee to fund Virginia roads when they may just passing through," said Miller, who added, "Virginia should have enough courage to tie the funding source for roads to a gas tax."

Yes, they should Mr. Miller.  But unfortunately, courage is in short supply when you get to the Republican-controlled House of Delegates in Richmond.  How do you spell Virginia House Republican?  C-O-W-A-R-D. Also, H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E.  The answer?  Get these guys the HELL out of here come November.  To paraphrase AAA, the General Assembly cannot continue as it is.  Let's change it.


Comments



I (leftofcenter - 8/24/2007 8:32:19 AM)
hate to say it ut these fees aren't going to be repealed. Even with all the outrage, the politicians and Kaine especially aren't going to throw them out. They will probably expand it to include out of state drivers since they think this is everyone's biggest complaint. Good luck enforcing that in 50 states. They may give judges more freedom to reduce the fines. The political will is just not there to raise the gas tax.
I'm afraid we're stuck with the fees unless we happen to take over the house AND senate. But Kaine still wants the fees so we're stuck for now.


Expand, not Remove (Eric - 8/24/2007 8:48:38 AM)
I think that sums it up.  The Republican plan to "fix" their outrageous plan is to expand it.  They've dug themselves into a deep hole and their only solution is... to keep digging!

You know Dave Albo (R - Greedsville) wanted in on this.  Seeing his new lucrative lawyering fees slipping away, he has seized upon this apply-the-fees-to-everyone fix and hopes that every other state will play along with his get-rich-quick plan.  "Del. David B. Albo (R-Fairfax) said Virginia might expect other states to suspend the licenses of residents who incur a fee in Virginia but do not pay it."  Which prompted the (in my words) go-screw-yourself response from Maryland.

If we re-elect these same Republicans who don't get it, we are going to get more of the same.  They'll tweak a few details of this bill, but why on earth should anyone believe that this is a turn to responsible government?  If they fix the problems with the bill (not likely anyway, but let's roll with it), where are they going to get the funding for the rest of transportation bill?  What other devious irresponsible plans will they hatch?

Folks, this is easy.  We need new leadership in Virginia.  Period.  Get out there and do everything you can to overthrow these flat-earth ideologues who don't, and never will, get it.



And (leftofcenter - 8/24/2007 10:01:24 AM)
we all need to insist to our local legislators that we want this REPEALED not tweaked. We want it gone. Period. No wiggle room. Kaine also needs to hear this on a daily basis because he seems intent on not repealing it but actually expanding it.
The only good thing is because of this issue we might pick up some more seats than we originally thougt we would.
I'm trying to be positive.


Karen Schultz agrees (Lowell - 8/24/2007 8:48:55 AM)
Schultz calls for a reality check in Richmond and repeal for Abuser Fees

Winchester- In response to the Republican attempt to salvage the bad abuser fee legislation Karen Schultz, candidate for Virginia's 27th Senate District, called for real representation in Richmond today on the issue of transportation.

"The response today  from the Republican majority in Richmond avoids reality and the real issue, finding a sustained source of funding for transportation in Virginia.  It also shows a continuing disconnect from the people of the Commonwealth who have made it very clear their view on the issue and are demanding common sense representation."

Schultz also stated that, "It is time the legislature faced reality. This is a bad idea plain and simple. Promoting safety on our roads and funding badly needed transportation infrastructure are separate issues and should be treated that way.  The abuser fees must be repealed and replaced with a reliable source of funding."

"This bad piece of legislation uses our police officers and state troopers as tax collectors.  Their focus should be on the public safety of The Commonwealth, not on funding road construction."

"The fees were designed to raise revenue, not provide safer roads.  It is not a logical statement to relay to Virginias that the fixing of our roads depends on habitual and criminal traffic violations.  The people of Virginia have voiced a strong opposition to the abuser fees.  In the Senate, I will make it a priority to work with efficiency, innovation, and to secure a sustained source of funding to solve our transportation crisis."

Go Karen!



AAA are morons (Emperor Palpatine - 8/24/2007 3:12:47 PM)
I don't know where the hell Michigan came up with this random 12% reduction bullshat. Just last MONTH in the article they did when they questioned MI state police they had NO CLUE as to the impact of our driver fee law, yet now they do?? Someone is feeding a line of bull. They have NOT done any official impact study, and are not scheduled to do so until the end of this year since it has been 4 years in effect. And even NJ admitted in that article that their law has had no noticeable affect on accidents.

"Cathleen Lewis, a New Jersey motor vehicle agency spokeswoman, said there is no way to determine whether the fees "conclusively impact highway safety."

In Michigan, traffic fatalities declined 12 percent from 2003 to 2005, compared with a 2.2 percent increase nationwide during that period, according to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration."

  YET!!!
"A spokesman for the Michigan State Police said it is too early to tell whether the decline can be attributed to the fees."

To make things worse, in the MI paper just yesterday, OUR drunk driving death rate has gone up as well as for TX. So who the hell is putting these lies out there that MI is safer for our "bad driver" tax? I think it went up 10% for drunk driving deaths. That makes the 12% for MINOR stuff seem like going in reverse after your foot has been crucified to the gas pedal.

How can AAA be so stupid as to claim to not know anything about how bad these fees are from the beginning, and support them until now? Don't they do business in the failing states of NJ, MI, TX? I guess they're incompetent too. Buy your insurance from PROGRESSIVE.



I know that this site in particular (Va Blogger - 8/24/2007 10:14:42 AM)
Wants to see a repeal of the abuser fees all together, but you have to understand the shifting dynamic of this issue.

Before this week, you were on the side of the masses. There was a massive outcry against the abuser fees in their current form, and you were leading the charge against them.

You understandably omitted that the calls for a special session, from Republicans and Democrats alike, fell on deaf ears in the Governor's Mansion, as the only person who could convene a special session has adamantly refused to. I know you try your damndest day and night to shift blame from Democrats like Kaine to the Republicans, but it is an interesting sidenote.

Knowing that Kaine would not call for a special session, no matter what, the Republican Leadership announced they were doing three things: 1) Making the law apply to all drivers, not just Virginia residents (which was the most controversial problem, also incidentally Governor Kaine's fault), 2) Eliminate Class 3 and Class 4 misdemeanors from the abuser fees, and 3) Retroactively apply from the time of passage to July 1st to acquit anybody that was caught that would not have been but for these changes.

You are still beating the same drum--repeal them all--but perhaps your standing isn't as solid as it used to be:

http://www.washingto...

"GOP leaders are emboldened by internal party polls showing that voters want the fees modified to include out-of-state drivers but that majorities support the concept and think the fees will lead to safer highways."

173,000 people signed a petition opposing the abuser fees in their current form. But you absolutely *cannot* claim that 173,000 people want the abuser fees repealed all together. Many of those, if not most, wanted them amended to reflect the changes the Republican leadership is enacting. The "movement" you're leading is now cut by at least half.

I know this isn't going to stop you from beating the same drum, especially since Governor Kaine can't be held accountable for his major part of this bill (and that's all right with you), but you should keep this in mind, and pass it onto any Democrats in the State Legislature, like Brian Moran who foolishly claimed that 200,000 people wanted these laws repealed. Not so, Brian. You may continue to beat the same drum, but you may not be in the majority anymore.



That Republican "poll" is nonsense. (Lowell - 8/24/2007 10:21:39 AM)
n/t


Well, it's not, though. (Va Blogger - 8/24/2007 11:05:21 AM)
I haven't seen the poll, and neither have you, so I can't claim that that the poll is valid, and you can't claim that its invalid. But either way, there is still a point here.

Many, many people wanted the law changed. Some wanted it amended and some wanted it repealed. Now that it is slated to be amended, the size of the "movement" you're leading in opposition to the abuser fees is cut significantly. The only question is how much.

I haven't seen or heard of any polling on the matter other than the one reported by the Washington Post, and I have no overt reason to doubt it. If it is true, then the majority of those opposed to the abuser fees only wanted it amended, not repealed.



I've talked to people who have done polling (Lowell - 8/24/2007 11:33:12 AM)
The Republican "poll" is crap.


I've talked to people who have done polling as well (Va Blogger - 8/24/2007 11:45:46 AM)
And they and I disagree.

Are you going to do anything other than trash a poll that shows results you don't like? We can make baseless statements until we're blue in the face, but that doesn't change the fundamental point behind my comment, which you continue to ignore.



So wrong in so many ways (Eric - 8/24/2007 11:19:12 AM)
First, I'll give you a minor kudos for nailing one aspect: that one of the reasons there is such outrage is that these rules don't apply to everyone.  But I'm going to have to disagree with you on just about everything else.

1. Back to Basics.  The whole reason these fees appeared as they did is because the REPUBLICANS refused to raise the gasoline tax.  They were never about safety as all the supporters are desperately claiming now.  You can't fix this aspect by doing anything but scraping the fees.

2. Back to Basics 2.  Suppose the eligible violations are rolled back to just the worst of the worst.  Good move but what now happens to that projected $60M revenue?  That was based on nailing simple 20+mph speeders, people who failed to signal, and improper tread depth.  By greatly reducing the eligible citations they will drastically reduce revenue.  So do you think they'll increase a tax to make up the difference?  Hell no.  I don't know what they're planning on doing but I'll bet it's an equivalent level of stupidity and irresponsibility as the original fees are.

3. Apply to all Drivers - NOT.  This isn't going to work very well.  Maryland has already told Virginia to screw itself on the matter and I'll bet most other states will as well.  They can change the rule (assuming they figure out a way that doesn't send the funds to education) but very few out-of-staters will pay because their own states aren't going to go along with Albo's get-rich-quick plan.

4. Forget about Kaine.  He's not running.  But go ahead and campaign against him if you want.  And bitching that we blindly support him doesn't fly either - for the 100th time, go back and read old posts and comments.

5. You're probably right about that 200,000 number.  The reality is that it's much higher.

Why are we even going through this ridiculous exercise?  The easy solution is to repeal the fees and address the two issues, funding and safety, in two separate bills that each focus on handling their issue the right way.  Oh wait, I know why - because the flat earth ideologues are in charge.  Fix that in November and we'll fix this problem.  And many others.



"The easy solution" (Va Blogger - 8/24/2007 11:54:55 AM)
That is *your* easy solution. Other people don't have a problem with the fees after they are amended, and therefore don't need or agree with that easy solution.

1. The only reason why there was a need for transportation money to begin with was because Richmond, under two Democratic Governors, has spent money on everything but transportation. How much money from the 2004 tax increase went towards the biggest problem we face today? Little, if any at all. Why would I support another tax increase when I have no reason to believe that it will go to fix transporation problems?

2. How about we cut back on non-essential services and send more Northern Virginia money back to us, instead of continuing to be screwed by Richmond?

3. "Maryland" has not told Virginia to go screw itself. A Democratic member of the Maryland State Senate has doubts of its effectiveness. Oh my. At any rate, it's at least refreshing now to know that cops on the Beltway will persue any car that's driving recklessly, and not just ones with Virginia plates.

4. You are conflating the two. Just because someone can't be held accountable electorally doesn't mean they aren't responsible. I'm not trying to "run against Kaine" in 2007. I'm trying to put the blame where the blame is due. Governor Kaine is majorly responsible for this mess, and I'm not going to stop saying so just because I can't vote against him this fall. Saying "Forget about Kaine, you can't run against him" is like saying "Forget about George Bush, you can't run against him." Somehow, I don't see that message sticking.

5. Again, you don't know how many people want the fees repealed versus want the fees amended. At least some only wanted them amended. A poll was reported as saying it was the majority. Lowell disagrees with the poll for non-specific reasons, but at the very least, we know that not 100% of the people who oppose the fees want them repealed. The only question is how many.



Don't play the partisan game. (BobDole - 8/24/2007 1:03:22 PM)
"Again, you don't know how many people want the fees repealed versus want the fees amended.... like Brian Moran who foolishly claimed that 200,000 people wanted these laws repealed. Not so, Brian."

No, actually, it is so. Read the petition: >>We, the undersigned, demand the immediate repeal of these civil remedial fees.<<

Brian Moran is one of only 18 members of the House of Delegates that has been 100% consistent and honest about the fees. Only 18 can say they voted against the fees when it was a standalone measure in the House of Delegates, so making this a partisan game is garbage. Both sides FAILED.

It's totally dishonest to say the Howell-Stosch-Kaine plan to "fix" the fees is anything more than smoke & mirrors. Eliminating Class 3 and Class 4 does NOT remove "driving with bald tires." It does NOT remove "failure to use a turn signal." It does NOT remove driving 16 MPH in the HOV lane on 395.

By expanding the fees to include new victims, they can lower the amounts on a handful of offenses. It's simple economics. What is at issue here is that the police should not be responsible for raising revenue. Both sides FAIL on this question. Except Brian Moran (D). Except Kathy Byron (R). If Kaine opposed the fees, the fees would be dead right now. Kaine FAILED.

P.S. AAA are a bunch of lying backstabbers:
http://www.thenewspa...



Ok, I meant "easy" in (Eric - 8/24/2007 3:56:59 PM)
terms of what approach needs to be taken.  The actual work to produce two good bills would be very difficult.

For point 1, why don't we go back even further?  How about to the last time gasoline taxes were raised?  It's been over 20 years - meaning inflation has effectively been reducing the tax for 20 years.  Virginia's rate is among the lowest in the country.  There is simply no good argument against a modest gasoline tax increase to help pay for the transportation bill.  If you want to talk about other taxes and other state services that's a different issue altogether.

Ok, technically Maryland didn't tell Virginia to screw itself.  Technically Maryland is a geographic region and can't speak because it doesn't have vocal chords.  But I'm pretty sure the official answer we will hear the leaders of other states will be a tactfully worded version of "go screw yourself".  Can you imagine how those politicians would explain to their constituents why they want their own people to pay another state's outrageous fees?  I don't see it happening, but you're more than welcome to buy into that fantasy if you wish.

As for Kaine, somehow you're under the impression that this mess is his fault and that's that.  I feel he bears some of the blame (and have said so numerous times) but that the heart of the problem is the House Republicans.  I'll tell you what - you help us get a Democratic controlled legislature and let's see what Kaine does then.  If we still end up with such garbage legislation I will be glad to support your position that Kaine is the problem.  Until then, it's crystal clear that the Republicans are primarily to blame.